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11:21 pm November 28, 2009
| Luke Maurits
| | Adelaide, Australia | |
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According to the Wikipedia article on project Gemini:
The original intention was for Gemini to land on solid ground instead of at sea, using a paraglider rather than a parachute, and for the crew to be seated upright controlling the forward motion of the craft before its landing.
There's an illustration here. This would kind of have made Gemini a little like a miniature space shuttle. I find this idea kind of attractive for a few reasons:
- Landing on solid ground feels a little safer and a lot easier to me than a splashdown. With a splashdown, we'd need either a large boat equipped with a crane or a heavy lifting helicopter to retrieve the craft – these would both be expensive. Also, we'd need to get to the splashdown location quickly or risk a drowned astronaut. If anything went wrong during landing, drowning would be a serious risk. In contrast, recovery on land would require only a moderate sized truck for recovery, we could take hours to find the landing site if there was a tracking problem with minimal risk to the astronaut (the craft itself would provide ample protection from the elements, wildlife, etc), and a broken limb during a rough landing would hurt but not cause drowning.
- The softer the landing, the more of the craft we can reuse. I know I've mentioned this before and it's met with some skepticism, but if it is at all possible I would love for our craft to be reusable, to save on cost. Obviously, heat shielding would need to be refurbished or replaced, but I suspect just about everything else should survive the mission, with the possible exception of the main structure of the craft. I feel like a soft landing on solid ground would be gentler on this than a splashdown.
Thoughts?
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Main CLLARE workgroups: Mission Planning, Navigation and Guidance. I do maths, physics, C, Python and Java.
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10:00 am November 29, 2009
| Rocket-To-The-Moon
| | Grand Forks, North Dakota, USA | |
| Member | posts 666 |
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Post edited 4:05 pm – November 29, 2009 by Rocket-To-The-Moon
I think we should do whatever we can so that the capsule is reusable. In my opinon I think that a parasail is probably the single best option for us since it is easy to pack and steer.
I'm still somewhat concerned about landing on land though. With a parafoil and GPS we could easily land someplace within 500 meters of the shore of a lake. Lake Okeechobee in Florida (or one of the Great Lakes) would be ideal for this because it is large enough that there are certainly some fairly large boats that could help in the recovery. Since we are uncertain about the accuracy of our reentry we could aim for the middle of the lake and deploy the parachute at a high altitude of 30-40,000' so that we would have 20-30 minutes to glide to our precise destination.
This is the type of stuff that will be fun to test during the early unmanned launches.
X-38
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Main Workgroups: Propulsion & Spacecraft Engineering
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7:51 pm November 29, 2009
| Luke Maurits
| | Adelaide, Australia | |
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I found a photo of the proposed Gemini paraglider system. The use of actual landing carriage has me a little confused, everything else I have read has said the system would land on skis, which I presume would take up a lot less space inside the capsule. That said, the Gemini capsule in this photo is only a model, not a genuine capsule – perhaps they just put it on wheels for convenience.
 
The wing looks here like it has a rigid internal structure, but everything I've read says that it is actually inflatable. I am assuming that before deployment it is packed down into the capsule taking up perhaps just a little more space than a regular parachute. I have read that in the event of a paraglider failure, a parachute landing was still possible, but I don't know if this means there was a regular parachute in the capsule or, since Gemini featured ejection seats just like a jet fighter, it means the crew used parachutes while the capsule just crashed. Ejection seats sound not-simple to me so I'd be inclined to give them a miss, but I guess that depends on how reliable the paragliding system is. If it is more prone to failure than a simple parachute landing it seems a little unfair to use it if the crew will not have an alternative.
I guess landing in a lake would minimise some of the issues associated with an ocean landing. There may be environmental issues to consider. I suppose all the really nasty chemicals would be attached to our propulsion system which would simply burn up, but I don't know if the ablative heat shielding will produce anything unpleasant while it burns away. Also if people use those lakes for boating or fishing or the like regularly we might get in trouble for just dropping on in. It's well worth considering, though.
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Main CLLARE workgroups: Mission Planning, Navigation and Guidance. I do maths, physics, C, Python and Java.
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8:11 pm November 29, 2009
| Rocket-To-The-Moon
| | Grand Forks, North Dakota, USA | |
| Member | posts 666 |
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Main Workgroups: Propulsion & Spacecraft Engineering
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11:25 pm November 30, 2009
| perpindicular
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another suggestion i'd like to throw in would be huge infllating balloons. i believe one of the mars rovers had it, or planned to have it. If the astronaut can handle the bouncing upon landing, they could help against a soft landing but they migh thave to be extremely massive and we would need a simple deflation system once it was at full stop. i think three decent size balloons at three points could do it well.
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11:59 pm November 30, 2009
| Luke Maurits
| | Adelaide, Australia | |
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| posts 1409 |
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I know the Mars Pathfinder used a lot of giant balloons for landing, I remember seeing pictures of it in newspapers when I was younger (before widespread web access). The Wikipedia article for Pathfinder doesn't say much about it, though, but there are probably details on the web somewhere. It does mention that solid fuel rocket boosters were used too.
I'm not sure what size the balloons would need to be for this to work, I wouldn't even know how to go about calculating it. It's woth considering, though, although perhaps only if a paragliding solution doesn't work – the bouncing could be problematic, both for the astronaut and for equipment we may want to salvage. Even if we could make it work, I don't know if it would be cheaper/simpler than other alternatives. Definitely worth considering, though.
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Main CLLARE workgroups: Mission Planning, Navigation and Guidance. I do maths, physics, C, Python and Java.
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