Subscribe to rss feed

Definitive new fuel mass estimates | Mission Planning Workgroup | Forum

 
You must be logged in to post user permissions login Login register Register


Register? | Lost Your Password?

Search Forums:


searchicon 






Minimum search word length is 3 characters – Maximum search word length is 84 characters
Wildcard Usage:
*  matches any number of characters    %  matches exactly one character

topic

Definitive new fuel mass estimates

print
small tagNo Tags
UserPost

1:03 am
January 15, 2010


Luke Maurits

Adelaide, Australia

Admin

posts 1483

offline
link
print
1
0
ratedowngrey
rateupgrey

Post edited 7:10 am – January 15, 2010 by Luke Maurits


Okay, so I've written a small program (will push it to my Hg clone later tonight) that makes it a piece of cake to compute total mass figures using the rocket equation.

The graph below shows total launch mass (y-axis) vs fuel Isp (x-axis) for 5 different stack masses: super light (750 kg CM, other structures similarly unrealistically light) all the way up to super heavy (1750 kg CM, other structures similarly unrealistically heavy).  The medium option is quite sensible but still I think still a little conservative: 1250 kg CM, 400 kg lander, 500 kg PM, etc.  We should expect to manage medium, the other options are just there to show how much spare mass we have before things stop being feasible and to show us how much mass we'd need to shed to be able to user lower Isp fuels than LOX/LH2.

The delta-v budget here is 3100 m/s for TLI, 1000 m/s for LOI, 3400 m/s for the lander and 700 m/s for TEI, with a 10% safety margin on top of each burn's budget.

Fuel analysismouse

The horizontal brown line shows the Falcon 9 maximum LEO payload.  For each of the stack mass options, if you find the point where that stack's line intercepts the brown horizontal and then mentally draw a vertical line down to the x-axis, it shows you the minimum Isp required to get that stack to fly in a Falcon 9.

The heavy and super heavy options will never fly on a Falcon 9, so we absolutely must beat those estimates.

The medium option, which is a sensible, slightly conservative estimate of masses, requires an Isp of about 410s.  LOX/LH2 can easily manage this.  This means that the overall mission is absolutely feasible using a Falcon 9, which is good news.

The light option, which would require hard work to keep mass down but which is not outside the realm of possibility, requires an Isp of just less than 350s, which means we could use LOX/LCH4 (LCH4 is safer, easier to store and more dense than LH2).  We should strive for this due to the advantages of LCH4, but probably not expect to make it.

Note that 350s seems to be about the average Isp of all of the LOX/LCH4 engines on this page, but some individual engines go as high as 380.  If we can get decent LOX/LCH4 engines with these higher Isps, we wouldn't need to do quite as good a job as the light option requires.

The super light option requires 300s, which would make LOX/RP-1 feasible, but I would be amazed if we could get things that light without resorting to super expensive/exotic materials everywhere possible.

Summary: CLLARE on a Falcon 9 is definitely possible using realistic mass estimates if we can get working LOX/LH2 engines.  It may well be possible to use LOX/LCH4 engines if we do a really excellent job of keeping mass down everywhere.

I'll put this graph or one very like it in the next version of the CLLARE Project Overview Document.

Main CLLARE workgroups: Mission Planning, Navigation and Guidance. I do maths, physics, C, Python and Java.

4:27 am
January 15, 2010


Luke Maurits

Adelaide, Australia

Admin

posts 1483

offline
link
print
2
0
ratedowngrey
rateupgrey

Well, this is what I get for having the audacity to use the word "definitive": I completely forgot about the mass of the Orbital Support Module when writing the code that produced this graph, so they're a little off.  I'll try to get a new version done later tonight or tomorrow.

Main CLLARE workgroups: Mission Planning, Navigation and Guidance. I do maths, physics, C, Python and Java.

6:52 am
January 15, 2010


Rocket-To-The-Moon

Altus, Oklahoma, USA

Member

posts 685

offline
link
print
3
0
ratedowngrey
rateupgrey

Post edited 12:53 pm – January 15, 2010 by Rocket-To-The-Moon


Fuel analysis heavymouse
As a point of reference I added the Falcon 9 Heavy to the graph. It has a LEO capacity of 29,610kg.

Basically the F9H makes anything possible.

Main Workgroups: Propulsion & Spacecraft Engineering

7:00 am
January 15, 2010


Luke Maurits

Adelaide, Australia

Admin

posts 1483

offline
link
print
4
0
ratedowngrey
rateupgrey

Do you know if the F9H is intended to be man-rated?

Good idea including it, though, I'll do so in future plots because it's a good reference to have.  The issue of man-ratedness and the substantially increased launch cost ($78 mil instead fo $35 mil) means we should try to avoid going over the regular F9 limit like the plague, but it is good to know that if we absolutely can't help it, the F9H will have our back.

If the F9H is man rated, it could make a great launch platform for heavier moon trips, with multi-person crews and long term stays.  Or possibly even, dare I say it, a Mars trip!

Main CLLARE workgroups: Mission Planning, Navigation and Guidance. I do maths, physics, C, Python and Java.

7:13 am
January 15, 2010


Luke Maurits

Adelaide, Australia

Admin

posts 1483

offline
link
print
5
0
ratedowngrey
rateupgrey

I have uploaded a new version of the plot which (i) includes an OSM mass (ranging from 100 kg in super light to 300 kg in super heavy) and (ii) includes a Falcon 9 Heavy line, like Rocket's modification of the original.

Since I uploaded it over the old version rather than as a new file on the Wiki, the image at the top of this thread should now be the correct one.  Just note that the commentary below it in terms of Isp requirements is no longer quite right.

The changes are relatively minor and this entire prospect is still feasible.

Main CLLARE workgroups: Mission Planning, Navigation and Guidance. I do maths, physics, C, Python and Java.

4:54 pm
January 15, 2010


Rocket-To-The-Moon

Altus, Oklahoma, USA

Member

posts 685

offline
link
print
6
0
ratedowngrey
rateupgrey

I'm not sure about the F9H being man rated or not so I sent an email to SpaceX to inquire.

Using the base F9 is by far the optimal choice. It looks like we are close enough that it will probably be possible with strict mass control.

Main Workgroups: Propulsion & Spacecraft Engineering

small tagNo Tags

About the CSTART – Collaborative Space Travel and Research Team Forum

Forum Timezone: UTC -6

Most Users Ever Online: 59

Currently Online:
7 Guests

Currently Browsing this Topic:
1 Guest

Forum Stats:

Groups: 4
Forums: 36
Topics: 512
Posts: 3809

Membership:

There are 1133 Members

There are 2 Admins

Top Posters:

Rocket-To-The-Moon – 685
brmj – 402
rpulkrabek – 348
DenisG – 69
antinode – 64
J. Simmons – 46

Recent New Members: jmwright, uhwuggawuh, seikialice88, bishvabis, alijayadv, harris

Administrators: Luke Maurits (1483 Posts), Rizwan (170 Posts)



 
share save 120 16