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Completely new CLLARE design.

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1:40 pm
March 19, 2010


brmj

Rochester, New York, United States

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Rocket-To-The-Moon said:

I assume this to all be the case. I am thinking that a simple modification of the fairing with a hatch in the side could possibly solve the problem. There is also the issue of SpaceX actually allowing us to launch inside of a fairing with no launch abort capability.


Your assesment perfectly matches up with my understanding of this topic. The Falcon9 user's guide said that they can have up a few ports in the fairing, potentially up to a useable size, if I remember correctly, and on-pad access to the payload is avaliable for an added fee.

The launch abort issue worries me a bit. I'm pretty sure it would be completely unprecidented to have a maneed spacecraft with no abort modes. Perhaps we could figure out how to do a Gemini- or Vostok-like ejection seat through the hatch that we'd have to add anyway. That would add sobstantial complexity and mass, though, and it strikes me as problematic at best. As an alternative, I wonder if we could give it a launch espace system internal to the fairing, put the capsule at the top of our stack and use a combination of air drag and the existing, presumably pyrotechnic system to seperate the fairing if it becomes necessary. I belive it opens into two pieces lengthwise on the falcon 9, so I can imagine this working during launch if the initial explosives were powerful enough to force it open enough to catch some air. Thoughts?

Main work groups: Propulsion (booster), Spacecraft Engineering, Computer Systems, Navigation and Guidance (software)

3:06 pm
March 19, 2010


Rocket-To-The-Moon

Altus, Oklahoma, USA

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The Space Shuttle essentially has no launch abort method, at least not that can save the crew in a true emergency.

If SpaceX allows us to launch with no launch abort then I don't think it will stop us from pressing forward. The best option that I can come up with off the top of my head is to put the CM on top with the legs pointing down and using the descent engine (which has far too little thrust to be useful in this applicaiton by itself..and the ignition sequence is probably too slow) and additional solid rockets.

Main Workgroups: Propulsion & Spacecraft Engineering

12:58 am
May 1, 2010


Luke Maurits

Adelaide, Australia

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A few quick updates on this:

We probably need to abandon the spherical CM idea.  When I stated that it subjected the occupant to 8-9 g during reentry, which was uncomfortable but entirely survivable, I was not taking into account the increased reentry velocity for lunar return missions.  This is about 3000 m/s higher than reentry velocities for LEO, and this increases the acceleration.  A pure sphere will subject its occupant to about 20 g during reentry from the moon, which is well past human endurance.  A large ballute could lower this to an acceptable limit but (i) see below commentary on ballutes and (ii) if the ballute were to fail in some way it would be a fatal problem with no hope for recovery, which seems like something to avoid.  That said, parachute failure is a pretty serious problem too, but (i) parachutes have a pretty solid track record, whereas ballutes are super new, and (ii) I think multiple redundant parachute systems are likely to be much more achievable than multiple redundant ballute systems, from a mass/volume/cost perspective.

As for ballutes: I have read a few papers on these now and am not quite so enthusiastic about them – for CSTART.  They are a fantastic idea in general and I think they show a lot of promise.  But they are by no means cheap or simple yet.  Most papers stress that for ballutes to become practical as routine and reliable devices for atmospheric reentry, some advances in materials technology will be needed.  Ballutes require fabrics, plastics or metallic films (or layered composites of more than one of these) which are simultaneously very low density but still able to endure thermal loads which exceed the tolerance of most off-the-shelf materials.  The first working ballutes for something like lunar return reentry are probably going to be made of multiple different materials at different parts of the ballute, and all of them are likely to be composed of several layers of unobtanium).  This doesn't make ballutes completely impractical for CSTART, but it seems clear that parachutes are going to be a heck of a lot easier overall.

With regard to replacing the spherical CM, I have started to think in terms of a "headlight" shape, as seen on the Soyuz reentry module (see here for a nice diagram).  This has an L/D ratio of about 0.3, which is enough to significantly lower reentry g forces, still has a fairly good volume to surface area ratio (it was designed to maximise this ratio, subject to providing adequate lift for lunar reentry), and I think it might actually be easier to work with, e.g. attaching the landing legs/engine/tank assembly to it's mostly flat bottom will be a lot easier than attaching the same thing to the base of a sphere.  We do lose the ability to do independent translation and rotation using a single set of thrusters, which is quite sad, but this might just be something we have to accept.

I have a few more thoughts brewing on how to configure all these bits of hardware, but I'll hold off on posting them until I have given them a little more thought.

Main CLLARE workgroups: Mission Planning, Navigation and Guidance. I do maths, physics, C, Python and Java.

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